Glasgow Jewish Educational Forum

Community Voice

Welcome to the Community Voice page, a forum dedicated to the discussion of communal affairs.

coffee-and-bagels-3.png

To have your say about the future of the community, please help yourself to coffee and bagels and join the debate.

43 Responses to “Community Voice”

  1. debbie said

    Now maybe that’s what Glasgow Jewish community needs – a good coffee and bagel shop!! Did there not used to be one a few years ago ?

  2. NLL said

    On Mon 5th March, Cosgrove Care are opening a tea shop in Skirving St that I think will also sell 2nd hand CDs & books as well providing training in basic retail & food hygiene. Possibly not quite what you were thinking of….. but certainly a Community endeavour.

  3. jezabel said

    Can i have a cup of tea? no sugar cos i’m on a diet. How about a jewish slimming club ? The one i go to are always saying how low fat seafood is!!Can we have a woman’s only blog? I’m sure we women wouldn’t be as rude to each other as the men!

  4. Richard said

    How about encouraging Carmelli’s to open a branch in Giffnock?

  5. NLL said

    Many moons ago – whilst studying Community Education – we were taught that community cafes were a good way to bring people together and one way to start discussions was to put up a notice board and encourage people to leave anonymous messages with their thoughts and ideas. Now we have the modern version right here, unfortunately virtual coffee and bagels don’t taste quite so good, although they would be ideal for Jezabel’s diet!!!!

    The skill is in moving towards change by taking the positive ideas and developing them, without being patronising – whilst ignoring the inevitable jokers and those who think they are being clever. Trouble here is nobody is being paid to do this, so we all have a responsibility to (in social work speak) ‘manage the change process’

    ohh – its getting late & this is getting far too heavy – I’ll need to come back to this………….

  6. debbie said

    Jezabel I am with you on the women only blog although knowing some of our men they would want to get in on the act and post under psuedonyms anyway!! I do think it is worth considering though.

  7. Richard said

    I’m not sure a ‘Women only’ blog is feasible in the current format (although Admin is the chap to answer that), however are you sure that it is the best thing to do? One of the biggest advantages of internet discussions is that you are taken on what you say (both good and bad!) rather than who/what you are. It is one of the arguments in favour of nicknames over real names. It is the female posters here who have been most consistently reasonable and that can only be a good thing

    FWIW I would rather more people voiced their opinions than stayed silent as the best way of drowning out the trolls (troll = someone who posts for the sole purpose of causing trouble).

  8. Interested said

    I just logged on here by chance and surprise surprise Richard’s here as well. And yet again he gets it wrong – this is becoming a habit.
    Why on earth should there be a blog just for women? Don’t think too many will vote for Jezabel as being “consistently reasonable” on this blog. I wouldn’t. And just in case Richard starts to rewrite fact into fiction – it was his ridiculous accusations that were posted ” with the sole purpose of causing trouble”
    As I said in the education blog, I have had enough of this behaviour.

  9. Richard said

    What is your problem ‘Interested’, apart from an inability to read English properly?

    If you were to take the time to read the posts properly you’ll find that I disagree with Jezabel and agree with you!

    If you, Interested, are tired of normal reasonable discussion then I suggest you leave well alone. I am trying to keep to a subject and you are intent on raking up the past. You know who I am and have the advantage so why don’t you contact me privately and we can discuss this face to face. I am sick to death of this constant barrage of bullying tactics and will not be driven away by such petty behaviour.

    I made a reasonable point that you are free to argue against if you so wish but try to be accurate.

  10. debbie said

    Interested #8 I like the idea of a women only blog. Who is asking for votes or have I missed something?

    Can we not move on from previous behaviour and start a dialogue which is at least curteous? Just like you interested I have had enough of this behaviour!

  11. Interested said

    Well Debbie – why would you like a women only blog – what would you discuss on it – that you feel men should be excluded from? It’s a bit like that “women in the community thing”
    I never really understood why Jewish women thought about women’s issues 20 years after everyone else did with women’s lib etc.

  12. Misunderstood said

    Why would Debbie & Jezabel actually want a women only blog. What exact purpose would it serve and how would you know if only women accessed it?

    I suppose there is nothing wrong with it in principle but why not just have an all-in blog like this one and we can all contribute as and when we want to.

    I support Richard’s view on this one – surprising as that may sound.

  13. NLL said

    why do people get into such a tizzy? There we were having some light, semi serious banter and suddenly this has descended into point scoring and name calling – again.

    Clue – Debbie, Jezebel & NLL are female and I suspect Richard & Interested may well be male. Please can the 2 of you go and continue your argument elsewhere?

    Richard I know you are passionate about these issues, but slow down, calm down and let this whole process, blog, meetings, discussions with friends etc meander around a bit.

  14. Debbie said

    Thanks NLL, you are absolutely right and as we(women) all know, we are the far more sensible sex.

    I wish you lot would all stop nit-picking, stop taking yourselves so seriously!

  15. Ben Avraham said

    Some years ago my son was attending a morning lecture at university when he developed stomach cramps. As soon as the lecture was finished he ran swiftly to the nearest convenience raced in and dived into a free cubicle. He had hardly settled down when, from the safety of his cubicle, he heard others entering the convenience. To his horror it was the voices of females who he thought had strayed into the wrong room. As more voices came and went and they were all female voices it soon dawned on him that it was not they who had erred but he himself now trapped in splendid isolation. He realised that there was a momentous decision to make. Should he finish the matter at hand, get up and brazenly walk out with courage and aplomb or alternatively, he could sit it out for two long hours until the afternoon lectures started and things eased off? He stayed. For an eternity he stayed and sat there and listened. He listened and listened and heard things no man had ever heard before and which no man in his lifetime should have to hear again.
    So to all you men who would listen in, I warn, be careful. It is a dangerous and traumatic sport and should the worst happen and you succumb to those dangers there is no known cure.

  16. jezabel said

    As a mother of young kids i can’t always get out in the evening without paying expensive babysitters {i know NLL one day i’ll be crying over my empty nest!]So it would be nice with my cup of tea and one biscuit [some hope] to talk to other laydees about laydee things!misunderstood you join in if you want to be a laydee too!

  17. NLL said

    Very fair point – and interestingly quite a lot of our (more progressive) communal bodies are doing a lot of their business electronically, so cutting out the need for lengthy – tedious – meetings.

    Advantage; people in Jezebel’s situation – surely part of the ‘target group’ – can participate without needing expensive babysitting

    Disadvantage: may not be quite so socialable…….. but on the other hand committees can arrange to meet socially when it does suit members, and don’t have to spend much of that time on busines matters.

    It’s a changing world!

  18. debbie said

    Hello anyone out there, I miss my little chats with the girls, I was enjoying a bit of banter without all the backstabbing vitriol on the Jewish education page!

  19. NLL said

    off to London for a Bat Mitzvah – definitely up for more gentle banter – catch up next week.

  20. Jezabel said

    On purim NLL? I hope you are going in fancy dress!I hope all calderwood kids will get to a shul this purim and make lots of noise,i don’t think i’ll dress up although after being on this blog a burka would be a good idea!

  21. Debbie said

    have a lovely time nll and Jezabel and I will keep up the good work till you get back

  22. Jezabel said

    Spent purim night at Giffnock shul,turn out was not great seeing as we have nearly 200 under 18s in the membership, did any one go to the other shuls if so how were things there?

  23. Chico the Clown said

    Went to NM Shul to entertain the masses and was pleasantly surprised at how good the turnout was considering it was on a Saturday night. My only note of concern was that there were a number of children there who’s parents were obviously somewhere else and they would have swelled the numbers and made me look even better!

    Great costumes, great dancing and great food.

    Just sorry I cant make the AC Milan v Celtic game on Wed night at the Shul as I will be clowning it around somewhere else.

  24. Jezabel said

    well done Chico, At giffnock a giant frog handed out plenty of sweets, funny how no-one comes dressed as a dentist!

  25. Debbie said

    Jezabel are you on drugs – now you are seeing giant frogs in a synagogue!!

  26. Richard said

    No debbie, it was just a very strange weekend! On sunday night at giffnock shul we went to the most excellent dinner with award winning songwriter robert sherman and his son Robbie at this event hundreds normally sensible folk sang along to chitty chitty bang bang and winnie the pooh songs! Top marks to hard working Richard Kaye and team!

  27. Debbie said

    Richard Kaye has done really well at bringing unusual and interesting events. I know that he has also tried to get a youth group running up at the Habonim bayit.

    Chitty chitty bang bang I can understand but Winnie the Pooh – maybe you were all on drugs or just high on life!

  28. NLL said

    Sorry to have missed Purim happenings in Glasgow, but enjoyed a lovely Bat Mitzvah, incorporating Megilla reading and children in fancy dress in London. Good bit of networking also – chatting to various people, including Nicky Goldman who amongst other things runs UJIA leadership training programmes.

    Chico the Clown, interesting comment about unaccompanied children. When Purim (and other Festivals fall mid week, it seems parents aren’t around to bring their to shul and when its a weekend they dump them……………. it all comes back to the parents doesn’t it? I once chatted with Rabbi Rubin about actually offering formal childcare on mid-week festivals. What do those of you with younger children think? Doesn’t deal with issue of parental involvement, but gets those – mostly Calderwood – children not at school into shul.

  29. jezabel said

    That’s the second blog you have mentioned drugs Debbie maybe that would get people along to the Calderwood PTA meetings!!

  30. Debbie said

    I don’t think offering child care is the way to go better parents should be told that the shul is not responsible for child minding their children or perhaps making a cut off age. In other words you cannot leave any children under the age of 10 (for example)unaccompanied. It is irresponsible in my book.

  31. jezabel said

    as one of the few non-working mothers i do have sympathy with parents of calderwood children who cannot take time off work for all the mid week chagim so i usually have a couple of extra kids. I’m sure if others did the same we could swell the number of kids in shul! Although that doesn’t explain purim because that was at night!

  32. NLL said

    fair enough – you are both closer to the situation. It is difficult for people to get days off, particularly with Sukkoth & Simacat Torah following so quickly after Rosh Hashonna & Yom Kippur – although with current anti discriminatory policies I’d like to see any employer try and refuse.

    Leaving kids without making arrangements for them to be looked after is grossly irresponsible and certainly should be stopped.I just remember a great frustration, knowing there were Calderwood kids sitting at home with childminders when they could have been in shul

  33. Jack said

    Not everyone wants to be in Shul. It’s not compulsory!

  34. Eggbert said

    Who said it was Jack?

  35. Richard said

    Is this the same Jack who questions the need for Jewish Education?

  36. jezabel said

    Shul is not compulsory but a shul without kids is a forlorn sight especially at purim and simchat torah i should know we belong to garnethill !

  37. NLL said

    Ref article in this weeks JC about imminent release from prison of man who abused 2 Barmitzvah boys – suspect there wont be many unaccompanied children at Stanmore shul!! Now maybe certain people will believe these things DO happen in our ‘nice’ Jewish Community

  38. Controversial said

    Always new they did. I hate to say it but I wouldn’t want him in my shul. I wonder if they will let him attend and where the law both talmudic and judicial is on this matter.

  39. NLL said

    from the article, I believe they are taking legal advice re Human Rights Law, but my understanding – in Scotland, and I assume also down South – is that the rights and protection of children always takes precedence. People who commit crimes and serve their sentence need to be allowed to be rehabilitated – I feel this kind of crime is quite different and the issues are extremely complex. In Scotland legally it would depend on any conditions attached to his release and placement on the Sex Offenders Register.

    The challenge is in protecting children without becoming hysterical, wrapping them in cotton wool and creating an atmosphere of fear.

  40. A Beitz said

    Don’t see a problem with the civil law here. If the shul constitution permits it to bar people they can bar him.If it doesn’t they may have a problem provided he satisfies the criteria to permit him to attend. Talmudically I’m less certain but would have thought this man’s behaviour could justify a cherem ie excommunication. After all in the guise of performing a religious act ie teaching two boys their barmitzvot he sexually abused them.

  41. Debbie said

    I can’t see any synagogue welcoming this man as part of the congregation. What is more important, reassuring the existing congregants or providing a shul for him to attend without losing your other congregants?

  42. For all of you with family and/or friends in Australia and/or New Zealand, I run an online news service.

    J-Wire can be found at http://www.jwire.com.au and I welcome any Jewish news you may have from Scotland providing there is an Australian angle

  43. Rainbow Warrior said

    A community cafe in Glasgow? Don’t make me laugh!!! We are talking about a community that didn’t support various kosher restaurants when they were open!!!. Now we are reduced to a part-time venture by Lubavitch. Like him or loathe him, at least he sees the importance of having some sort of Heimishe Dining experience for Glasgow Yidden. I love the idea of a Kosher Coffee and Cookie House or a Internet Cafe/Bagel and Coffee Bar, but how many of us would support it in the long run? As always, there would be a faithful few, then it would fall by the wayside. When the biggest shul in Glasgow can no longer get a great weekday evening attendance, that is the reflection of what Glasgow Jews think of our community survival. All the Cheders are closed, our Jewish Primary School is under local authority control, our care homes are no longer under Jewish Community control. What next? There are smaller communities than ours around the world, that in spite of numbers, run successful ventures thanks to the support of their people.
    We could sit and lament the passing of the old days and the exodus of some of us to Northern and Southern England, Israel and elsewhere or we can make the best with what we have and shine as an example to other cities with similar numbers. What’s it to be?

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